The AE911Truth Petition
To the Members of the House of Representatives and of the Senate of the United States of America,
PLEASE TAKE NOTICE THAT:
On Behalf of the People of the United States of America, the undersigned Architects and Engineers for 9/11 Truth and affiliates hereby petition for, and demand, a truly independent investigation with subpoena power in order to uncover the full truth surrounding the events of 9/11/01 – specifically the collapses of the World Trade Center Towers and Building 7. We believe there is sufficient doubt about the official story and therefore the 9/11 investigation must be re-opened and must include a full inquiry into the possible use of explosives that might have been the actual cause of the destruction of the World Trade Center Twin Towers and Building 7.
Featured Petition Signers
Siegfried Wiesmüller, EE
Degreed
In my opinion there are too many contradictions in the official reportings.
Siegfried Wiesmüller, EE
Degreed
91336 Heroldsbach, Bavaria, Germany
I was born 1946. I studied electrical engineering and controll techniques (regulating circuits) and I teach these disciplines still today at a technical school.
In my opinion there are too many contradictions in the official reportings.
Zubair Waheed, MSc
Lecturate In Math And Physics
MSc Civil Engineering, DTU, Kongens Lyngby, Denmark, 1992
I do not believe in the official statement from neither the NIST nor from the American government. Scientifically, the destruction of the WTC 1, 2 and 7 towers…
Zubair Waheed, MSc
MSc Civil Engineering, DTU, Kongens Lyngby, Denmark, 1992
Taastrup, Denmark
Occupation: Lecturate In Math And Physics
I have completed a Master of Science in building construction.
I do not believe in the official statement from neither the NIST nor from the American government. Scientifically, the destruction of the WTC 1, 2 and 7 towers is not logical as currently explained by officials.
Andreina Pena-Isea
B.S. Civil Engineering (Honors)
There is too much conflicting information and the official sources continue to maintain a shroud of secrecy around the events that led up to the collapse of the…
Andreina Pena-Isea
B.S. Civil Engineering (Honors)
Katy, TX
Over 18 years experience in multidisciplinary, multi-million dollar projects, ranging from grassroots to environmental clean-up.
There is too much conflicting information and the official sources continue to maintain a shroud of secrecy around the events that led up to the collapse of the WTC. A complete and transparent investigation is needed to set the record straight.
Peter Gyurik, Bachelor Of Mech
Degreed
Don't believe the official story as it's not convincing. The official story only states what ignorant people want to hear.
Peter Gyurik, Bachelor Of Mech
Degreed
VXj, Småland, Sweden
Studied mechanical engineering on university level and got my degree 2008. I have since then been working as a Design Engineer.
Don't believe the official story as it's not convincing. The official story only states what ignorant people want to hear.
Hamid Mumin, PhD
PhD University of Western Ontario
Truth, ethics and professionalism are completely lacking in the official aftermath and investigations surrounding the 9/11 disasters. It appears we went to war predicated on false information. The…
Hamid Mumin, PhD
PhD University of Western Ontario
Alexander, MB
Professor of Geology and past Department Chair at Brandon University, Manitoba, Canada, and Adjunct Professor at the Department of Earth Sciences, University of Western Ontario. A Professional Engineer, Professional Geoscientist, and Association of Professional Engineers and Geoscientists of Manitoba past Director to the Canadian Council of Professional Geoscientists. Also past President of the Canadian Council of Professional Geoscientists which is the national council that advises all Provincial and Territorial engineering and geoscience associations on matters dealing with professional practice, conduct, ethics and standards, including international relations. Author and co-author of more than 80 scientific articles, monographs, and conference presentations on geoscience. Consults regularly for industry and continues to work on many areas of professional ethics and standards.
Truth, ethics and professionalism are completely lacking in the official aftermath and investigations surrounding the 9/11 disasters. It appears we went to war predicated on false information. The manner in which the World Trade Center buildings 1, 2 and 7 were brought down, at free fall velocity and disintegrating into a pyroclastic cloud of dust and ash, suggests a contrived and controlled demolition from within. Building 7 is clearly seen collapsing from the bottom directly into its own footprint, in a typical controlled demolition style, a fact completely ignored in the official investigations. Where is the proper investigation and who really benefited from this? It is time to conduct a proper investigation to uncover the truths behind 9/11.
Nicholas S. Hodge, AAS
AAS
What happened is just physically impossible, but I've actually had people tell me that it is possible for the top sections of the twin towers to fall at…
Nicholas S. Hodge, AAS
AAS
Louisville, KY
I attended ITT Tech from 1998 to 2000 in which I learned CADD and was introduced to many engineering fields. For the last ten years I have been working for a small signal engineering business. We mainly do contract work for BNSF railroad. Our work combines electrical, signal, and elements of civil engineering.
What happened is just physically impossible, but I've actually had people tell me that it is possible for the top sections of the twin towers to fall at the same rate throughout their collapses. Building 7 is just ridiculous.
Joel C. Colombo, AIA
Architect
See Tech biography
The appearance of jet wings capable of shearing a steel exoskeleton of a high rise would be next to impossible to horizontally slice the buildings floors in two…
Joel C. Colombo, AIA
See Tech biography
Wrightwood, CA
Occupation: Architect
Architect Technology Orange Coast, Vanguard University Alumnus, Harvard served as Architect Judge. California Licensed Architect & Builder. Designed & built all construction types 1 through 5. Commercial specialty custom steel fabricated large long span auditoriums up to 5,000 seats, building types institutional, educational, and mixed use from resort Conference centers, including master planning religious conditional use permitted developments. Interesting enough I have maintained during my developers career a License to use Trinitrotoluene 'TNT', plastics, & detonation cord explosives for building and underground uses.
The appearance of jet wings capable of shearing a steel exoskeleton of a high rise would be next to impossible to horizontally slice the buildings floors in two like a cake without strategically placed additional building demolition explosives onboard the jet and/or both the building structure. This happening twice in two separate buildings simultaneously is cause for speculation. There is a need for additional investigations and laboratory testing.
Norman S. Edwards
Systems Analysis
B.S. Mgmt Info Systems, Ambassador
My original gas volume analysis of twin tower collapse: If the towers collapsed due to structural weakness, the volume of air expelled from them would equal the gross…
Norman S. Edwards
B.S. Mgmt Info Systems, Ambassador
Port Austin, MI
Occupation: Systems Analysis
1978: Graduated first in class, Ambassador University. 1978-1994: Systems analyst and computer systems software designer. Responsible for many pioneer designs. 2004-2010: Director of PABC, including building maintenance.
My original gas volume analysis of twin tower collapse: If the towers collapsed due to structural weakness, the volume of air expelled from them would equal the gross volume of the building minus the volume of solid objects within it. Yet, it is evident from all videos that the volume of gas expelled was instantly many times the volume of the original building. Explosives within the building are the only credible source of this excess gas volume. Also, the speed at which the gas and debris was expelled horizontally from the building was approximately the same for all floors. This is exactly what would be expected if a similar set of explosive charges were detonated on each floor of the building. If the matter was expelled only due to the weight of above floors crushing the lower floors, the gas and dust would have been expelled a short distance at the beginning of the event when the speed of collapse was slow, and a much further distance on the lower floors when the speed of collapse was faster. That was not the case.
John W. Gray, BArch, BFA
Bachelor Architecture, Bachelor FineArts
I saw the collapse live on Television here in Australia and witnessed the most significant event in my life (next to the birth of my two children). Two…
John W. Gray, BArch, BFA
Bachelor Architecture, Bachelor FineArts
Melbourne, VIC, Australia
Self employed architect currently working in multi residential developments.
I saw the collapse live on Television here in Australia and witnessed the most significant event in my life (next to the birth of my two children). Two years later my sister mentioned about some alternative views on the events, which sparked my curiosity. When only looking slightly into the conflicting information it was clear that there was more to the story than i believed at the time.
Brett E. Diggins, EIT
Structural Engineer
BS Architectural Engineering and MS Structural Engineering, Milwaukee School of Engineering, 2010
Laboratory evidence of large amounts of thermite in both the rubble at ground zero and the debris powder in lower Manhattan as well as video documentation of molten…
Brett E. Diggins, EIT
BS Architectural Engineering and MS Structural Engineering, Milwaukee School of Engineering, 2010
Chicago, IL
Occupation: Structural Engineer
BS Architectural Engineering; MS Structural Engineering; EIT; Skidmore Owings & Merrill LLP.
Laboratory evidence of large amounts of thermite in both the rubble at ground zero and the debris powder in lower Manhattan as well as video documentation of molten steel streaming out of one or both of the towers before collapse is irrefutable. The tower collapses were not natural, but were without a doubt assisted by heavy duty explosives.
Sarah Cain, Writer/Researche
Writer And Tech
For a long time, I have questioned the way that the towers fell in the manner of a controlled demolition, and the fact that WTC7 fell long after…
Sarah Cain, Writer/Researche
Mocksville, NC
Occupation: Writer And Tech
I currently work as a writer and lead researcher for The Health Wyze Report. In addition, I am a Python programmer, webmaster for AE911Truth, and staunch advocate of Free and Open Source software (F.O.S.S.). I am a Linux user, and host L.A.M.P.-based systems.
For a long time, I have questioned the way that the towers fell in the manner of a controlled demolition, and the fact that WTC7 fell long after the terrorists flew into the first two towers.
John D. Gilmore, Civil Engineer
BS CE Purdue University
We need an independent investigation of the events of 9/11/2001. The published 'findings' cannot possibly be accurate.
John D. Gilmore, Civil Engineer
BS CE Purdue University
Norcross, GA
I received a BS in Civil Engineering in 1993 and a Master of Business Administration degree in 2005.
We need an independent investigation of the events of 9/11/2001. The published 'findings' cannot possibly be accurate.
Petition Signatories
Jenny L. Lee-Davis, BSc
Birmingham, AL
Occupation: Housewife
Education: Degree
Jenny L. Lee-Davis, BSc
Degree
Birmingham, AL
Occupation: Housewife
BSc psychology degree. Achieving a 2:1 classification. Perusing a Masters in the very near future.
Always in support of the many, not the few. Justice seeker & activists supporter.
Stephen Olson
Mountain View, HI
Occupation: Disabled Laborer
Education: High School Diploma
Stephen Olson
High School Diploma
Mountain View, HI
Occupation: Disabled Laborer
Concerned citizen
William Knospler
Augusta, NJ
Occupation: Self Employed (Retired)
Education: HS
William Knospler
HS
Augusta, NJ
Occupation: Self Employed (Retired)
40 years all together.Field Engineer - Radioactivity measurement equipment, Biological Research measurement equipment, Diagnostic Ultrasound Imaging equipment (patent holder image enhancement method). Design of radio isotope monitoring computer based instrument for Analytical Chemistry application, Hardware/Software design and integration. College night courses, calculus and statistics, no degree.
A full and complete investigation should be conducted while witnesses are still alive; memories are fading. There seems to be a great body of evidence that, if it were considered and included in full context, would cast considerable doubt on the official findings.
Mathew T. Smith
Carthage, TN
Occupation: Automotive Technician
Education: Trade School
Mathew T. Smith
Trade School
Carthage, TN
Occupation: Automotive Technician
I am an automotive technician for Fiat Chrysler. I went to a trade school to be a technician and now that I have become a technician my education never ends.
I believe there are too many coincidences with everything that happened on 9/11 for it to have been a terrorist attack planned by a guy hiding in a cave with a deadly kidney disease.
John Poland
Thiensville, WI
Occupation: Business Owner
Education: College Grad - BS
John Poland
College Grad - BS
Thiensville, WI
Occupation: Business Owner
College graduate with a Bachelor of Science in business administration and minor in economics.
A business owner and American who would like a independent investigation of 9/11.
Aaron Francis
Irvine, CA
Occupation: Researcher
Education: University of California Irvine
Aaron Francis
University of California Irvine
Irvine, CA
Occupation: Researcher
A guitar technician and troubleshooter for a plumbing company.
The biggest thing that is ignored is that we had steel and concrete turn to dust, while they both free fell into their own footprints. In addition, there we many eye witnesses (firefighters) saying bombs were exploding when the building went down. Lastly, building 7 feel into its own imprint just like the twin towers and 'no plane' hit that one. Building fires do not cause buildings to free fall.
Cornelius Lüling
Hamburg, Germany
Cornelius Lüling
Hamburg, Germany
Ain't got architecture or engineering education, but it's obviously a frame!
It's a frame! Nothing fits together! The government's lying is ridiculous!
Lieve Claes
Auroville, India
Lieve Claes
Auroville, India
Drama school, stage actress for 15 years, now honorary voluntary worker in a township experimenting to embody human unity.
We all know what a burnt-down building looks like. We all know what controlled demolition looks like. And still we are told to disbelieve our eyes and believe some absurd story.
Kevin J. Bennett
Creston, CA
Occupation: Cabinetmaker
Education: 12
Kevin J. Bennett
12
Creston, CA
Occupation: Cabinetmaker
High school grad. Welder Carpenter/Cabinetmaker/Musician.
On September 11, 2001, three high rise buildings in New York City were destroyed by means of a pre-planned controlled demolition. The official report and NIST investigation were nothing but a cover-up for a criminal act orchestrated by some of the most diabolical humans to ever walk the face of the earth. Manufactured consent in its most evil form!!!!
Theresa M. Dillon
Bellevue, OH
Occupation: Retired
Education: College
Theresa M. Dillon
College
Bellevue, OH
Occupation: Retired
Graduated in 1975, college 1976-78. Retired from factory work of 27 plus years.
I have always felt that 9/11 was a planned disaster and we will never be the same in this country because we have been lied to by those who we thought we could trust! ... once your eyes are open to their deceitfulness you are always suspicious from then on ... it is so sad to be lied to by your own government that you grew up believing your country was built on believing in GOD and all it stood for ... I'm sad to be an American in the USA!!!
Jason Stephenson
Windang, NSW, Australia
Jason Stephenson
Windang, NSW, Australia
I don't have official experience in demolition. I do however, have experience in seeing demolished buildings coming down.
It was clear to me that these buildings' free falls were demolition. Nothing else to say
Michael Manganelli
Hazle Twp, PA
Occupation: Construction
Education: High School Diploma
Michael Manganelli
High School Diploma
Hazle Twp, PA
Occupation: Construction
I have nothing academically to provide to the movement but I am not quiet. When there is an ear that will listen, I speak. I finished high school in Pennsylvania in '06 and furthered my education at a community college. I did not receive a degree, as I did not finish. Thank you for listening, regardless!
I am a red blooded American, I may not have the highest level of education but I am not unintelligent. There is overwhelming evidence that has not been included in the official record, as well as the removed physical evidence.
Joseph W. Rogers, MBA
Woonsocket, RI
Occupation: Wastewater Operator
Education: MBA
Joseph W. Rogers, MBA
MBA
Woonsocket, RI
Occupation: Wastewater Operator
I have a BS in environmental science and I currently work in wastewater.
I believe we are missing pieces of information on the events of 9-11-01.
Joseph A. Rinaldi
Wading River, NY
Occupation: Retired Global Risk Insurance Director
Education: Post BA
Joseph A. Rinaldi
Post BA
Wading River, NY
Occupation: Retired Global Risk Insurance Director
From a recent professional bio ...Joseph became an independent consultant in January 2009 after retiring from Motorola in Schaumburg, IL, where he was their Director of Corporate Insurance. Joseph has over 35 years of experience in manufacturing, conglomerate, and technology risk & insurance management programs including, global property, liability, cargo, management liability, aircraft liability, and related areas of insurance. Joseph also became a senior risk management associate of Montclair Risk Advisors in early 2009.At Motorola Joseph was responsible for the global property/casualty insurance and loss control programs covering 500 locations throughout the world. He was also a director of Motorola property/casualty captive insurance subsidiaries. Additionally, he served on the Factory Mutual Eastern Regional Risk Management Executive Council, and in various capacities on the Board of Directors of the NY Chapter of RIMS including Chapter President in 1998. Before that Joseph was the Director of Risk Management at Symbol Technologies, Inc. based on Long Island, NY, and the Director of Risk Management at American Standard, Inc. in NYC. He ran both companies' global insurance and loss control programs.Joseph started his career as a liability claim adjuster at Liberty Mutual. He then joined The Royal Globe Insurance Companies as a liability claim adjuster. He quickly progressed to liability claim supervisor. While at Royal he also served as an instructor for the company's nationwide classes of newly recruited claim adjuster trainees.Joseph has a Bachelor of Arts degree in Economics with a minor in Education from the City College of New York. He also completed graduate studies toward an MBA degree at C.W. Post University. He holds a resident General Insurance Consultant's license, and a Broker's license in New York State.
Simple. Two air liners could not be the primary cause for the towers to collapse in their own footprint almost exactly alike. The air liners were used as the cover story in my opinion.
Patricia N. Sheppard
Mebane, NC
Occupation: Retured
Education: AAS
Patricia N. Sheppard
AAS
Mebane, NC
Occupation: Retured
Executive Secretary and also worked as an IBM Database Administrator, responsible for 4,500 customers (all IBM employees throughout US & UK).
I was working for an architect as his bookkeeper at the time those towers fell! I knew it was controlled demolition that day!!!!
Deniz Dedeoglu
Mnchen, Germany
Occupation: Skilled Metal Worker
Education: mid school
Deniz Dedeoglu
mid school
Mnchen, Germany
Occupation: Skilled Metal Worker
I'm a son of a German mother and a Turkish father.
At the end, truth always has the better arguments. Don't worry be happy.
Joan C. Seaman
Philomath, OR
Occupation: Retired
Education: Some college
Joan C. Seaman
Some college
Philomath, OR
Occupation: Retired
Graduated with honors from high school; one year of college at Duquesne University School of Pharmacy, followed by business school for Medical Secretary (not enough math prior to college). Have worked almost 40 years in the medical field in various positions including secretary, personnel coordinator, administrative assistant, transcription supervisor, transcription QA, and medical office supervisor. My father was a Civil Engineer involved in building steel mills in the 60s and 70s and passed along a lot of the principles of building.
As with many others, I will never forget that day. I still find it hard to comprehend such mass destruction and loss of life in such a horrible way. I have watched many documentaries about 9/11. This one from 9/11ExpertsSpeakOut really explained in scientific and pretty much irrefutable clarity how those three buildings fell the way they did. It makes sense. I questioned how they could fall using the explanations given in the past; however, since I am not an engineer or scientist, I did not have the knowledge with which to question what we were being told. Now that I have seen this documentary, I truly feel that another, independent, investigation is needed to uncover the truth, whatever that may be.
Rob R. Hecimovich
Madison, WI
Occupation: Self Employed
Education: College
Rob R. Hecimovich
College
Madison, WI
Occupation: Self Employed
College educated with degree in Speech and Public Relations.
Too many facts have been ignored and irregularities not investigated, which implies media is controlled and sadly, public is asleep.
Tommy R. Aldridge
Solvang, CA
Occupation: Musician
Education: 2yr college
Tommy R. Aldridge
2yr college
Solvang, CA
Occupation: Musician
Lifelong musician recording/performing artist. Have been a member of several multi-platinum recording/performing bands and continue. Would like to participate in any way to see the truth made known.
Committed to having the truth made known about the occurrences on 9/11.
Finno Furre
Malmo, NE
Finno Furre
Malmo, NE
Marketing/management bachelor, 25 years in sales/sales leadership
Building 7 collapse is clearly a controlled demolition, the world needs to learn the truth.
Christopher Hills
Toowoomba, QLD, Australia
Occupation: Paramedic (Retired)
Education: Paramedical Science
Christopher Hills
Paramedical Science
Toowoomba, QLD, Australia
Occupation: Paramedic (Retired)
James Shanley
Cortlandt Manor, NY
James Shanley
Cortlandt Manor, NY
Community College, work in home repairs.
Shameful!!!!! Revelation 20:12 ESV And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Then another book was opened, which is the book of life. And the dead were judged by what was written in the books, according to what they had done.
Laura A. Hall
Flanders, NJ
Occupation: Pr
Education: BA
Laura A. Hall
BA
Flanders, NJ
Occupation: Pr
Twenty-eight year PR professional, CEO of my own PR agency.
Evidence is fact. The government needs to be fully investigated for its cover ups. Especially out of respect for the victims and their families, some of whom I knew as a New Yorker.
David Duggan, CPA, CMA
Mississauga, ON, Canada
Occupation: Trader
Education: BBA, CMA, CPA
David Duggan, CPA, CMA
BBA, CMA, CPA
Mississauga, ON, Canada
Occupation: Trader
Finance and IT. I have been around long enough to know that if it walks like a duck and sounds like a duck and looks like a duck, the wife will probably laugh at you for cooking it like a chicken.
I see visual explosions as the buildings collapse (WTC 7 and one of the Twin Towers) via controlled demolition. If WTC 7 was rigged to explode, and it looks like it was, then I submit the other towers were also rigged to explode. Evidence points towards nanothermite being used.The symmetrical fall of the buildings, the exploding steel propelled laterally outwards, pulverized concrete turned to dust, no big objects left over in the debris field are giveaways. Follow the money.
Kelly Baltzell
Hanover, MN
Kelly Baltzell
Hanover, MN
MA level education. Interested in the truth. Been following along for years.
The truth needs to be told. Not what was put in Mainstream Media. The people who masterminded this need to be brought to justice and people told the truth.
James Tahara
Pasadena, CA
James Tahara
Pasadena, CA
Just another young American citizen who survived the public education system. Reading about conspiracies is a hobby of mine.
Janet Hubschman
Brick, NJ
Occupation: Disabled
Education: High School Grad
Janet Hubschman
High School Grad
Brick, NJ
Occupation: Disabled
While I'm only a high school graduate, I worked in insurance for about 30 years, taking numerous courses to get licensed,maintain the license, and for further education. For most of my career I was an Account Manager for major commercial accounts with premium volumes of $3,000,000 to $100,000,000.
I always felt that we were not told the truth about what really transpired on 9/11, and strongly feel that we are entitled to the information.
Ryan Asuncion
Ewa Beach, HI
Ryan Asuncion
Ewa Beach, HI
High school diploma and some college. I worked at restaurants as a waiter. I did all types of work really. I'm a green belt in karate. I have 10 plus years of volunteer work with kids/teens/adults affected with cancer.
I feel we are owed the truth, too many things don't add up with the official report.
Robert D. Burnard, CPA
Las Pinas City, Philippines
Occupation: Retired Cpa Financial/Investment/Tax Advisor
Education: BA Business Administration
Robert D. Burnard, CPA
BA Business Administration
Las Pinas City, Philippines
Occupation: Retired Cpa Financial/Investment/Tax Advisor
BA in Business Administration with emphasis in Accounting. 40 years with my own CPA tax/financial/investment advisory services.
Looking for the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth.
Musa Ayoob
Manchester, United Kingdom
Musa Ayoob
Manchester, United Kingdom
Property Cobsultant for many years. Have watched many controlled demolitions and 9-11 looked exactly like that.
It was a controlled demolition as assessed by the footage!!
Scott R. Wilson
Yakima, WA
Occupation: Sign Designer
Education: 1 year college
Scott R. Wilson
1 year college
Yakima, WA
Occupation: Sign Designer
Nil
Nil
Anthony W. Oliver
Centerburg, OH
Occupation: Disabled
Education: High School / GED ---- Trade School / JVS / Welding
Anthony W. Oliver
High School / GED ---- Trade School / JVS / Welding
Centerburg, OH
Occupation: Disabled
Kindergarten - Senior High School - Did not graduate but do have GED. Senior Yr was taken at a local JVS where I studied in stick / TIG/ MIG Welding and received a certificate of Completion. I have had several welding jobs after finishing school - Columbus Steel Castings - Mercury Machine and Tool - McGill AirClean LLC - Care Tree Systems etc.
I honestly have nothing to put into a 'statement' that would be able to be printed but I will at the least say this. It saddens me to this day to think not only of the nearly 3,000 lives lost, but even more-so that the 'American Public' believe this entire Bin Laden / Terrorist lie. I just cannot fathom anyone being able to watch these buildings fall 'into' themselves and still believe that they were 'knocked' down by Passenger Jet's. People Of The U.S. - Wake Up!
Daniel W. Kramer
Maria Stein, OH
Occupation: Construction
Education: High School
Daniel W. Kramer
High School
Maria Stein, OH
Occupation: Construction
I am a contractor who has done jobs from concrete to fine furniture. Currently a trim carpenter in commercial construction. Around 70% of my work in the last 25 years has been in modern steel frame buildings in all stages of construction or remodeling, I know how strong these structures are.
When explaining steel frame construction (as in building 7) to the uninformed, I like to simplify for better understanding. Imagine a solid steel frame stool bolted together. Now imagine several placed stacked together, tied vertically and horizontally with a thin slab of concrete between each floor. then add fireproofing. If you take out a few legs and start a massive fire in a few sections of this structure, would it fall? If it did how would it look? What would it take to make it collapse at near free-fall rate.